Interest in "Los Gatos"

I feel that A LOT more information needs to be made public about "Los Gatos," probably on the forum. Right now, it feels like a secret club in which some people know the information and everyone else just knows rumors.

For instance, how will the training paln be different? I for one cannot go to Nationals, but I still want to train with the fast girls.

Also, there is a huge problem trying to gauge end of the year performance on beginning of the year times. I would have never made the Nationals team at the beginning of last year, and several people who were fast at the beginning couldn't go at the end due to school.

I think all of the information about "Los Gatos" should be discussed, instead of just stated. We have a lot of bright people on the team that can help generate ideas and refine those ideas into feasible projects.

Adrian has some good/valid questions. And alot of poeple are voicing concerns.

I firmly beleive, that discourse is a good thing and this needs alot of public discourse, to find out where the club is going. I had a long talk with Cameron tonight, and he has some good points. I think this would be a great place for people to voice their concerns (without getting too emotional but, not loosing the passion). Cameron is a capable leader and failing to bring these issues to him is failing to utilize his skills and that hurts us all.

This club is way more than four officers and ten elites. Participate in the democracy that is TriCats.

Although well-intentioned, I think Chris was premature in having interested people sign up before we know what this will/will not become. Let us, with your input, define the program before acting.

Simply put, in order to be competitive at the National level, we need to be able to provide some additional training guidance to those identified to be "contenders" if you will. In the next year(s) there will be either (or both) qualifying races or qualifying standards for Nationals; we need to be prepared for this.

Whatever this idea becomes, it will not exclude the beginners or newbies, it will not divide the team, it will not be the focus of the team or its leadership and coaching, it will not decide in August who goes to Nationals, nor will it be an exclusive "elite team" that does their own thing. This will be a way to identify and maximize the training for those who have the background, consistency in training, time and ability to be competitive at Nationals.

We have lost participation by those who become competitive as they remove themselves from the TriCats to seem more focused training. We hope to bring them back in to help grow the team and teach the less experienced TriCats, by offering a more focused training program. This will allow us to have a more competitive team at Nationals, or when initiated, to allow us more people at Nationals through the qualification criteria.

Please keep an open mind about this. Your officers have one, and are working hard to find a way to make this the most open, inviting, inclusive, and effective program we can. It's too early to act since we have no program, but use it as an incentive to keep your training up over the summer!

Yeah, exactly, I was just throwing stuff out there to see what the response would be. I think Brian definitely has the final say on how the training plans will be handed out, when, and to whom.

I have been busy thinking about selection processes, and I ran into a couple of roadblocks when I think about how to talk to these people that are selected, will they have to be sold, will they have fears, what will their objections be (Can I do this and still graduate with honors, and do my ROTC responsibilities?), what kind of goals will they have. It is hard to write this stuff without talking to you guys about about it.

One thing that I feel is very necessary is a specific date or race that these people can plan for and visualize. People setting personal goals to qualify for this program is key to it's success, and the only way someone can set a realistic goal is to have some kind of number, or date, or something measureable to work towards far in advance.

By mentoring, i mean Los Gatos will be responsible for helping who they are mentoring to set, and acheive goals through a system that we are developing for TriCats.

Speaking as someone who loves this team dearly and has always enjoyed the fun open aspect I think this could also be a positive force and add another dimension to the team, not narrow it down.

As I understand it, it will be a very transparent group and far from exclusionary I think it will be a very open process that will let people figure out for themselves if they want to commit 20+ hours a week to this sport. I think that is more the purpose than really the Nats focus. There is only going to be a small percentage of people that realize they can commit this time to training mentally and physically and I see this program as a way for people to test their limits not as a winnowing agent. If they do institute these cut off times you are going to want to know if you can train at that level because everyone else who will be making the cutoffs will be doing the same (a lot of them do already). And being that a lot of the workouts would happen at the same time and place there would be as much interaction as we see between color groups already.

As far as the racing goes it will be the difference of the team truly focusing on a regional "A" race this time around. Think about what the Saguaro man kind of hodge podge was like, we could do far better than that with this kind of planning. We could even try setting up a conference championship type race as the mirror to nationals. With the qualifiers that are soon to be for Nats I have a feeling there will be tons of college kids plowing hundreds of hours into this sport that would love to throw down in an all out conference title. As Cameron was saying, it would be knowing in advance the A races so Tricats could plan an amazing A race for those not going to Nats as opposed to the scattered way it was this year. It will give new and seasoned people alike something to focus on and drive towards all year instead of just picking one that sounds good cause it fits into the training plan. Other than that I gather that this group would be at all of the same races as any other color group would be because...we would all be TRICATS!!!

The way I look at it as adding a 4th color group that, far from being removed from the team, will be even more interactive with the team then they would have been otherwise. And the only reason that they would receive "closer" training (which I think will be more of hanging around after a track practice or a Saturday brick for a little while and less of super secret powwows) is that at that level the balance between progress and injury/breakdown is so narrow that a single training plan could literally wreak havoc on one person at the level while being perfect for another.

Los Gatos could be the 4th dimension of the same great reality that is already Tricats.

The current program of Red, White, Blue forces people off of the team when they outgrow it, and if they don't leave they are completely frustrated with it. That does not follow the mission statement.I was forced out, Alex Waters, Kathy Rakel, Lou Maturo, Craig Pansing, Matt Beauregard, Alex Luce, Pete Tomcyzk, I am sure that I am missing people.

You guys need to solve for the mission statement. You need to find a solution to this huge problem.

There are a couple of people that you all see as part of the TriCat family who will be forced out next year because they are bored with how easy the Red plan is if you do not find a solution.

As near as I can tell our "mission" is defined by our statement of
purpose, and objectives, from our consitution. They read as follows:

Statement of Purpose - "The TriCats Triathlon and Multi-sport club provides an opportunity for
personal growth while promoting a common interest and fostering
participation and competition in triathlons and multi-sport events.
Club members are strongly encouraged to participate in races,
practices, and social events."

Objectives -

"The objectives of the organization shall be:

a. To promote interest in physical fitness through training and competing in multi-sport events,

b. To foster interaction among members and the surrounding community.

c. To represent student needs and wants in regard to training and competing in multi-sport activities.

d. To provide compensation/discounts for individuals competing in races."

So, really, I think any debate is more about how we as a team want
to interpret and apply those statements. On their face they seem to
support an inclusive club that meets all members needs, and lists
"training" as an objective but do not specify what form and level of
specificity that training should entail.

I agree with Chris that discussion is the best way to make decisions
and we should not fear argument. We also should not jump to conclusions but ask questions for clarification and make sure we understand what we are talking about. Of course, so far the only real
debate I've seen in this thread is Chris v. Chris. ;-)

My impression is that people on the team wants to include everyone,
including the advanced athletes. Personally I think Los Gatos sounds
like a good idea and worth the club's attention. The practical problem
is going to be (and I notice this is mentioned in the Los Gatos
document under Handbooks) the allocation of club resources. Will the
club be willing (or even need) to spend more per advanced athlete than per the rest of
the membership? Should advanced athletes be asked to take on a greater
role in fundraising if this is the case?

I agree with chris that the club should provide higher intensity practices for people who can compete at a higher level. However, I do not think that select faster members should receive preferential treatment/coaching/funding -- there are no try-outs to be in the club, therfore every member is equal. One of my favorite aspect of tricats this year was that dedication to the team and training, not speed, was rewarded.

If the red workouts are not enough for certain members, then I think we should provide more frequent/more intense workouts. However, these should be available to anyone who consistently attends red workouts -- it is not necessary to segregate a predetermined, elite group (especially in the fall, when the majority of the training is base training and our "A" races are so far away). It will just discourage and intimidate new members if there is so much pressure in the fall.

However, this is just my opinion. The club consists of over one hundred people who I'm sure all have varying ideas about the future of tricats. Therfore, I think we should brainstrom/vote on "los gatos" when we return in the fall, to make sure the entire club's best interest is met.

I think the Los Gatos concept is exactly what this team needs to go to that next level. The club swim team that I used to swim for added an elite group my junior year in high school, and while there was an adjustment where everyone was not quite sure about it, later everyone agreed that they really benefitted from the subdivision of the group.

One thing for sure though was things were never the same. I wouldn't say they went for better or worse; it was just different. If the Los Gatos program is implemented this fall I think everyone should know and expect that there will be changes, and I think they should go into it with an open mind. At Rio when we implemented the addition of the new national development group there were issues at the beginning between people who were part of the new group and those who were left behind (especially when training partners were in separated). An other issue was that some of the people in the senior group felt that their dues were too similar to the national development group without receiving the specialized training and performance reviews that the ND group was now receiving. These issues were resolved rather quickly and after the initial shock it really was a moot point.

To reiterate my earlier point, I think the pros far outweigh the cons and I believe the Los Gatos program will truly benefit everyone, fast and slow but we should be careful in doing so. Besides the additional resources that the presence of these members bring to the team, I think the competitiveness that the program brings to the national scene will usher in new opportunities for sponsorship and recognition that benefits the entire program. It would be very important that any new resources that are bestowed upon us as a result of the Los Gatos is extended to the entire team regardless of training group. I think sponsorship for just this part of the team would send a message that the other groups and their members are somehow less important to the club, which is something far from the truth. That being said, I don't think it is unreasonable for club resources to be allocated for nationals. The added prestige and opportunities a top tier team at a national scale can bring may be well worth some subsidization by the membership-at-large. I view it as an investment of a sort in the success and future opportunities of the club and its endeavors, as long as we have a good rate of return, I can't see the basis for an argument opposing subsidization from the pure economical stand point. (Eventually when were sponsored by every place that sponsors we may need to look at this again and re-evaluate the situation, and by that point we may not have to do fundraising to get to our big races)

Another important issue that somewhat piggybacks with the distribution of club resources is the dues structure. My observations at Rio stress the importance of the equity of dues with respect to the consumption of team resources. If the color groups are expected to pay $76 and get 12 hours of coaching per week, the 24 hours of coaching for the Los Gatos should cost $152. This is largely dependent on the additional demand on club resources that the Los Gatos program would add, the numbers I used here as examples could work out very different. The important thing I believe is the ability to show the members across the board that no one is getting a better deal than any other person. This would mean besides the proportion of race subsidization that a particular group may get, the two portions of the team--color groups and Los Gatos--is self sufficient.

Also, I feel like there needs to be concrete time standards for the groups to show that anyone is able to get any level of distribution from the club. This was less important in the past with just the color groups because they were accessible to everyone and the degree of difference between the groups was far less drastic than what I imagine them as after Los Gatos. Saying the top x number of people based on a qualifying meet is problematic. First, it is very hard to set a goal to work towards if you cannot measure it through out the season. How do you accurately measure if you are on track to make that twentieth spot if it's requirements are undefined past being top twenty? If a time standard is implemented then all the groups are still accessible. If there is concern that too many people will qualify for the group, we should set the time standard fast enough that all the spots will not be filled based on our current performances and expectations on improvement. After qualification rounds are over and if there are still spots in Los Gatos available then invitations could be extended to the next fastest people. Another option with the time standard is to mimic the olympic team selection process. Los Gatos could be all those people with the time standard and with in them the fastest x number of them get to go to nationals to represent Tricats. I personally prefer this process of selection, it is accessible to those who really want it and we still send the best team to represent at nationals, and we can legitimately show there is not a bias in funding for some people because the group is not technically closed to anyone.

I'm excited for the evolution of the team. I think the addition of Los Gatos is a great idea and will bring equally as great benefits to all the members of Tricats. This is the time and place to voice concerns, and for us to have a serious discussion on them. I hope that what ever solution is reached is accessible to anyone on the team, and besides some team resources being allocated to events that will bring us returns on our investment, that we place an emphasis on the equality and proportionality of the financial commitments of the members.

Lol ... roadie mentality. Very nice Chris

As an officer and recent member (this was my first year) of TriCats, my goal is to ensure that the club retains the qualities that made me
want to join. I believe that if Los
Gatos is implemented correctly, the program could be a
wonderful addition to the club. That
being said, the officers were elected to serve the needs of the team. Los Gatos
is still on the drawing board, suggestions and changes are being added as they
are voiced. I am glad that there is
discussion on the forum and if anyone would like to talk to me individually
feel free to call me (480)612-3438.